FEATURE｜The view of fashion for skaters and the image of skaters in the fashion scene.
HOUYHNHNM SKATEBOARD CLUB vol.5
The view of fashion for skaters, The image of skaters in the fashion scene.
HOUYHNHNM Skateboard Club," a skateboarding series hosted by Senichiro Ozawa, editor-in-chief of the skateboarding magazine "Sb," and Taro Hirano, a leading skateboard photographer, will be held for the last time in 2018, with "skateboarding and fashion" as the theme. The theme was "Skateboarding and Fashion". We welcomed a group of guests with different perspectives to discuss the close relationship between skaters and fashion, tracing the transition of skateboards and fashion. We are pleased to present you the precious contents of the talks, which are not easily seen in other media.
In the 1990s, as editor-in-chief of "WHEEL magazine," the first skateboarding magazine in Japan, he energetically covered skate culture in the United States, and in 2001, published "Sb SkateboardJournal. Since then, he has been writing not only about street culture but also about various aspects of domestic and international media while publishing regularly. His new trilogy of panda photogravure books, "HELLO PANDA," "PANDA MENTAL," and "HELLO PANDA CAKE," are now on sale.
Tairo Hirano (member of the Imperial family)(Photographer)
He studied photography as a contemporary art form at Musashino Art University. Later, he worked as an assistant at Kodansha and was involved in the launch of "WHEEL magazine" and "Sb," a skateboarding magazine, where he served as photo editor. Since then, he has been active in advertising, CD jackets, and fashion and culture magazines. His major works include the photo books "POOL", "Los Angeles Car Club", and "The Kings".
Guest
Mr. Toru Nishiyama(Director of WTAPS, FORTY PERCENTS AGAINST RIGHTS®, DESCENDANT, and WELD)
Born in 1975, he studied under Yoshiyuki Kitao at the age of 20, and after training as a writer for "POPEYE" magazine, he became an independent stylist. From 2012 to September of this year, he served as the fashion director of "POPEYE" magazine, and was the driving force behind the city boy fashion that was synonymous with the magazine. He is currently working on catalogs and advertisements for various magazines and brands, and directs in a wide range of fashion fields beyond the realm of styling.
Takashi Arai(Stylist)
Born in 1977, he began working under Yuta Kaji in 2001, and later became independent in 2003. He has worked for numerous fashion magazines, brands, and advertisements, and has also provided costumes for musicians and actors, as well as styling for movies and TV dramas. He is also known as a genuine skateboarder himself, and is trusted in many fields for his realistic dressing style. Instagram:.@niiiin2525
Taro Hirano ("Hirano")Good evening, everyone. This is the last lecture of the year for this HSC. Last time, we invited Takahiro Morita, one of the best videographers in the industry, as a guest speaker on the theme of skateboarding and video, and he spoke passionately about skateboarding and fashion.
We have a lot to talk about, but first of all, we will trace the history of skateboarding and fashion, and in the first half, we will have Mr. Nii, a stylist, talk about the skater fashion of the time, and also styling with the image of a real skater. In the first half, we have Mr. Nii, a stylist, talk about skater fashion of the time and styling with the image of a real skater.
Then, in the second part after a break, I hope to hear about their work with stylist Akio Hasegawa and designer Toru Nishiyama, and deepen our discussion about skaters and fashion. Do you think you can handle something like that, Sen-chan?
Senichiro Ozawa ("Ozawa")Yeah, it's perfect as usual (laughs). By the way, when it comes to the history of skateboarding and fashion, do you feel like talking about it from the 70's or so?
plainThat's right. According to one theory, skateboarding itself is said to have started in the 50's, but since I want to focus on the fashion aspect here, let's start with the 70's, when it is said to have spread as a byproduct of surfing, for the sake of clarity.
In the 70's, the movie "Dogtown & Z-Boys "*1
But as you may know, skate decks were different from today's skate decks, and the most common type of skate decks were small in width and length. And since the West Coast was the birthplace of skating along with the surfing culture, it was commonplace to skate with no top on. Even so, if you look at the feet, socks were high socks with lines, and shoes were most often Vans authentic, I guess.
If you look at the way Jay Adams *2, a member of "Z-Boys" who was a hero in the skater scene at that time, dressed in his childhood, you can hardly call it skater fashion. Really just kids' clothes. It was a time before skater fashion was even born, and once again, I feel like this is where it all started.
*1 Directed by Stacy Peralta, this gem of a documentary film chronicles the lifestyle of the skate and surf scene at the time it flourished on the West Coast in the 1970s. It features rare footage from those days and stars such as Jay Adams and Tony Alba, as well as interviews with them today. Narrated by Hollywood actor Sean Payne.
*2 A skater who was a hero in the 70's and a central figure of the "Z-Boys," a worldwide skateboarding movement that rolled out of Venice, California in the 70's. One of the purest skaters in the world, he never flirted with the mainstream, and was one of the best underground skaters in the world. He passed away in 2014.
BONES BRIGADE" was special. (Ozawa)
kozawa (Clausena lansium)It shows that they were not that conscious about fashion at that time. Even so, hairstyles could be an indicator. Everyone had long hair.
plainIndeed. While following the surfer style of the time, it also has the scent of 70s rockers, doesn't it? And by the time the "Z-BOYS," to which Jay Adams and Tony Alba *3 I mentioned earlier belonged, was in full swing, the way skaters dressed was shifting a little more toward a sports style, wasn't it? It would be easier to understand if I say that it is somewhat similar to the atmosphere of roller skating.
*3 Like Tony Alba, he is a legendary skater who was active in the 70's as an original member of "Z-Boys. He was also one of the first to skate on the pool ramp commonly known as "Dog Bowl," which was called the pool in the sky.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I guess it was a time when the use of color and other things started to pop.
plainThey used fluorescent colors and so on. Skateboard decks also started to become more graphical around this time, didn't they?
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Mm-hmm.
plainIn the 80's, a Japanese-American skater named Christian Hosoi *4, who is a hero for our generation, appeared on the scene. His way of dressing was very unique, and I think many people in Japan were influenced by his style.
*4 A charismatic Japanese-American skater active in the 80s. He had a rivalry with Tony Hawk, and had countless famous games that excited the skater kids at that time. He has the appearance of a rock star, and his skating style is wild and dynamic. In 2007, a documentary on his life, "RISING SON the legend of skateborder christian hosoi," was released.
*5 The brand was founded in 1984 by Jim Ganser, a Malibu surfer and artist. The brand developed a variety of surf and beach wear with the "Ford" woody wagon as its icon, symbolizing old surfing. The brand once came to an end with the passage of time, but in 2011, Ganzer himself relaunched the brand. The collection from that time, which was becoming a legend, has been reissued and is showing signs of a revival. The brand is synonymous with Christian Hosoi, and those who are familiar with the scene of that time have deep feelings for the brand.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I think Taro started skateboarding around this time, didn't he?
plainYes, it is.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)The cool skaters of the time would never wear the same outfit twice.
plainEveryone rips it off. Hosoi in particular, when given a T-shirt, would deftly cut off the sleeves and hem, and wrap the excess cloth around his arms and neck. At first glance, they looked like Kintaro, but this was the fashion or style of the time. It was a skater's way of thinking that they were free to arrange the items they received, even if they were from a sponsored brand.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Young people today may not understand this, but for those of us who were boys at the time, it was something to aspire to.
plainThat's right. Then there is "Bones Brigade" with Lance Mountain, Steve Caballero, Tommy Guerrero, and others, as well as Hosoi and Scott Oster *6 who was one of his associates.
*6 A skater who gained popularity in the "Bones Brigade," a group of skate stars representing the 80's, from his position as an ironic silver-tongued skater. The masculine riding photo taken at Beverly Pool, a famous spot at the time, is one that will remain in the memories of Japanese skate kids of the time.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Sure, "Bones Brigade" was a special one, wasn't it? And Tommy Guerrero and others were also cutting hems, weren't they?
plainSteve Caballero started a band around this time and leaned into the rock scene, and his fashion style was also like that, and Lance would wear knit sweaters that looked like they were bought at the supermarket around there. Come to think of it, he recently posted on his Instagram that he still had the paisley knit he wore back then on hand.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Tony Hawk is one of those images that was rather rich and classy.
plainYes, that's right. As I mentioned in the last time Morita visited us, his father was the president of the National Skateboarding Association of America. He was educated as a gifted skater and is said to be the most successful skater in the history of skateboarding. In that sense, he may have been in an environment that was a little different from those around him. Another skater named Mike McGill *7 is currently running a skate store in Encinitas, and Rodney Mullen *8 is actually a mathematician, as some of you may know. He's also appeared on an American TV program called "TED," where he gives presentations.
*7 A member of "Bones Brigade," he was a professional skater in his prime in the 80's. He is also known as the creator of the "Mack Twist," a trick often seen in the snowboarding scene today. He is also known as the creator of the "Mack Twist," a trick often seen in the snowboarding scene today.
*8 He made his debut as a professional skater at the age of 11 and joined the famous dream team "Bones Brigade" at 14. His career spans over 30 years, and he is a legend of the skate scene, having created many tricks that have become the foundation of street skating, such as ollies and kickflips, which have become standard nowadays. Also known as an erudite skateboarder, he is currently based in Silicon Valley as a mathematician and a popular speaker at various tech conferences.
plainHe was one of the first to adopt the freestyle skateboarding method, and he was also a man of genius who showed his talent without regret. I digressed from the topic of fashion for a moment, but the members of "Bones Brigade" introduced above were the charismatic figures of fashion in the skate scene of the 80s.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I wonder if there were any other fashionable skate teams around at this time that were modeled after them, with "Bones Brigade" at the helm?
plainThere was also a rock 'n' roll skate team called "Alba". In the mid-80s, skaters inspired by "Bones Brigade" started to find their own original styles, and their outfits were very different from each other. Everyone was influenced by their favorite music, art, etc., and they all developed their own styles.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Mm-hmm.
He broke the image of a crestfallen skater in a spectacular way. (Hirano)
plainThen, in the late 80's, an iconic skater finally emerged. That person was Matt Hensley *9. He broke the stereotypical image of a skater by wearing shorts made from German army pants, with a Harley-Davidson leather wallet with a chain in his back pocket.
And his mode of transportation is synonymous with "VESPA. The music he listens to is also mostly ska-punk and mods music, and you used a song from "Operation Ivy" for his video part. Recently, I've been playing accordion in a band called "Flogging Molly "*10 which is a kind of Irish punk band.
*9 Irish skaters suddenly appeared on the skate scene in the late 80s. He was a member of the charismatic teams "H-Street" and "PLAN-B," and is known for introducing the British style, which was revolutionary at the time, to the skate scene. He was also responsible for bringing military and biker items into fashion. He retired from professional skating in 1992, when he was in his prime, and now plays the accordion in a band called "FLOGGING MOLLY.
*10 Matt Hensley's punk band, known as the leading Irish punk band. Since its formation in 1993, the band has released a total of five full-length albums and four live and mini-albums. The band has also performed at the Fuji Rock Festival in 2006 and 2010, and continues to tour the world. Their representative songs include "Float," which is a band-like song, and "Laura," which is often mosh and dive at their live performances.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Yeah, it's perfect as usual (laughs). By the way, when it comes to the history of skateboarding and fashion, do you feel like talking about it from the 70's or so?
kozawa (Clausena lansium)There were a lot of imitators in Japan, too.
plainThe military shorts and chain wallet style was very popular. I have four pairs of military shorts myself.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I used to wear them all the time.
plainYeah, I know. Now that Matt Hensley's name has been mentioned, I would like to invite Nii, a stylist who was influenced by him as much as I was. Nii, please come to the front.
Takashi Arai (hereafter referred to as "Arai")Thank you for your cooperation.
plainIt seems that you didn't know Matt Hensley in real time, but what was he like for you?
new homeIt was obvious that he was good at skateboarding, but I think he was the first person to have a huge influence on other aspects of culture, such as fashion and music. Back then, when you went to skate spots, there were always people who were clearly influenced by Matt Hensley.
Until then, there were people who were fans of "POWELL PERALTA" and wore T-shirts of that brand, but I think it was Hensley who showed us his way of dressing, even though it was a no-name brand or plain color.
plainToday, we have Nii-san's styling of Matt Hensley's outfits from that time. It is interesting to learn not only from pictures and stories, but also by actually seeing these outfits as style samples.
new homeAt that time, as I mentioned earlier in the 70's, the skate scene was influenced by the surf culture, and the American atmosphere was the standard style in the skate scene. Hensley's family was of Irish descent, so his style was a novel British style at the time.
I think the MA-1 is the most obvious outerwear he often wears.
plainYes, this is the kind of Matt Hensley I'm talking about. Around this time, a lot of skaters dressed like this really started to appear in Japan. But it is not only fashion that is important. As Nii said, he was really good at skateboarding and his skating style was innovative.
new homeThat's right. I could clearly smell that he was different from other skaters.
plainYou also wore "AirWalk" mid-cut shoes with the cuff cut off.
Even if you imitate a skater's style, such a thing is just as unknown to the general public. (Plain)
plainThen, in the late 80's, an iconic skater finally emerged. That person was Matt Hensley *9. He broke the stereotypical image of a skater by wearing shorts made from German army pants, with a Harley-Davidson leather wallet with a chain in his back pocket.
And his mode of transportation is synonymous with "VESPA. The music he listens to is also mostly ska-punk and mods music, and you used a song from "Operation Ivy" for his video part. Recently, I've been playing accordion in a band called "Flogging Molly "*10 which is a kind of Irish punk band.
*9 Irish skaters suddenly appeared on the skate scene in the late 80s. He was a member of the charismatic teams "H-Street" and "PLAN-B," and is known for introducing the British style, which was revolutionary at the time, to the skate scene. He was also responsible for bringing military and biker items into fashion. He retired from professional skating in 1992, when he was in his prime, and now plays the accordion in a band called "FLOGGING MOLLY.
*10 Matt Hensley's punk band, known as the leading Irish punk band. Since its formation in 1993, the band has released a total of five full-length albums and four live and mini-albums. The band has also performed at the Fuji Rock Festival in 2006 and 2010, and continues to tour the world. Their representative songs include "Float," which is a band-like song, and "Laura," which is often mosh and dive at their live performances.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Why do you think all skaters cut off mid-cut or high-cut sneakers? Have Taro and others ever gone into that area?
plainTo Hensley? I don't think so (laughs). (Laughs.) But I skated myself, and I don't know how I felt. It was simply a hindrance, or maybe it wasn't necessary at that time.
new homeWhen we were kids, we used to do that with "CONVERSE" weaponry, didn't we?
plainYes, it is.
new homeWeapons used to be a stiff bash, too. Somewhere along the line, people started cutting them off with scissors and wearing them like skates.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)When you skated, did you skate in a Hensley style?
new homeThat's right. And I still ride a VESPA under the influence of Mr. Hensley (laughs).
plainI see. I like that (laughs).
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Taro was on board too, right?
plainI used to ride a VESPA back then, too. I used to ride my "VESPA" to skate spots. I wanted to copy Hensley's style with Toru, who would appear later as a guest in the second half of the show. There was a military goods store in the basement of the bookstore between the A and B buildings of the Seibu Department Store in Shibuya at the time, and I got information that they had exactly the same military pants there. I remember thinking, "This is it! I remember thinking, "This is it!
kozawa (Clausena lansium)What I always wonder is that skaters don't like to dress up as someone famous. And yet, a limited number of skaters accept it, don't they? I wonder why.
plainI wonder why for sure. I don't know, but I guess there was a part of me that only I realized how cool it was.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Oh, I see. So that's how it is.
plainWhen I was in high school, there were only a few people in my school who knew Matt Hensley. So even if I imitated the style of a famous skater, I would still be unknown to the general public.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Mm-hmm. Those words linked me to what Taro said earlier when we were chatting before we started. It made sense. It was a different way of dressing from the so-called "girl skateboards" and "CHOCOLATE," which are considered to be skater-like outfits.
plainThat's right. If it had been a style like GIRL SKATEBOARDS or CHOCOLATE, maybe many people would have known about it, and it would have been easier to imagine it as a skater's style.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)It was mainstream or basic.
plainIn addition, we were early adopters of Matt Hensley's style, which probably made us feel a little proud that we knew about it before it was fashionable.
new homeWhat were you wearing at the time, Mr. Taro?
plainI was wearing military shorts, a sweater, and sneakers, including the Vans chukka boots that Hensley used to wear. Of course, I cut off my military pants. I was riding a VESPA. I think I was a sophomore in high school.
new homeFour or five years later, I followed suit and dressed the same way as Taro. When I think about it, I am somewhat deeply moved.
plainHe was such an influential skater.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)By the way, does Taro have any memories of Hensley?
plainI still remember that when I came to Japan with "FLOGGING MOLLY," I did an in-store live show at "HMV" in Shibuya, and of course, I went to see the show with my friends. That was back when there was still an indoor bowl*11 in Meguro.
So we decided to go skiing there, but Hensley was wearing sneakers that looked like the cheapest work shoes you can find in an American supermarket. He told me, "I'm only wearing these today. I thought those shoes looked cool again (laughs).
*11 Skateboarding in a pool with no water in it, a style of skating developed in the 1970s by the "Z-Boys" and other skaters of the time. It is also commonly known as "dog bowl.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)How did you two manage to dig that deep back then when there was no Instagram or internet like there is now?
plainIt's a VHS pause.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I see (laughs).
plainI watch skating videos, pause at the angle where I can best see the clothes and shoes, and just stare at them. Sometimes I even rewind the video.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)That's how the value of skate photography was born. Brands and sponsors also look at skate photos from that perspective.
My passion for skating was linked to the aspect of fashion, where I was not a creator of clothes, but a coordinator. (Nii)
new homeI was the same way, but like Taro, I got to know skaters through the limited skate videos and magazines at the time, and I started to imitate their fashion first. But when I was a child, I couldn't even buy skate brand clothes, so I couldn't dress exactly the same way.
So, first of all, let's imitate the same color and silhouette of the clothes that the skater was wearing in the video! And I would start by trying to imitate the color and silhouette of the clothes worn by that skater in the video. I also tried to imitate the way jackets and shirts were buttoned up. I was inspired by skaters in the way they wore their clothes with only the top button fastened.
plainI somehow feel that this story is connected to Nii's current work.
new homeThat's right. My love for skating started from there, and in terms of fashion, I am not a creator of clothes, but rather a coordinator. If I hadn't been skating, I probably wouldn't be doing this job either. I think I would have led a completely different life.
plainIt's amazing that you think so.
new homeOf course I like skating, but I also like culture, including fashion. Especially since the 2000s, the level of skaters' tricks and skills have risen so much that I can no longer keep up with them. So I decided to focus more on skater fashion.
plainMm-hmm.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Personally, I think it's kind of uninteresting that skaters these days can coordinate their entire body with only skate brands.
new homeYes, I do. But sometimes there are young skater kids with a lot of sensitivity who have creative ways of dressing.
plainThat's right. Like Sen-chan's question earlier about imitating skaters, in the end, the most realistic style is the way kids in the U.S. dress. Magazine fashion pages, brand advertisements, and skater-themed movies were also important sources of information, but I think that the visuals in such media are somewhat staged.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)That's right. That's the only thing that hasn't changed.
plainIn the late 80's, Hensley appeared on the skating scene, and from the 90's, skaters' fashion changed drastically. First of all, the wheels*12 were getting smaller and smaller, and skaters would hang out at spots with their friends and compete with their skills rather than pushing around the city*13 in a glamorous manner.
Personally, I am impressed by spots such as the Ember Cadero *14 in San Francisco as symbolic spots of this trend. Looking at sneakers, I see a lot of diversity in skate shoes, such as the "PUMA" Clyde worn by Mike Carroll. T-shirts and pants sizes have become much larger since this period. How do you feel about this era, Nii?
*12 The size of 50mm to 60mm is the standard size of items sold at skate stores, and the selection criteria vary depending on whether the skateboard is a cruiser spec for street riding, a speed-oriented skater, or a trick-oriented skater. Other factors such as width and hardness are also said to affect the effectiveness of the product.
*13 One of the most basic tricks in skateboarding. It refers to the action of kicking the ground with the feet and moving forward while riding the skateboard.
*14 This famous spot was visited by numerous skaters in the 1990s and was the location for various films. The cool skaters who gathered at this spot inspired the kids of the time, and they all envisioned making a pilgrimage there someday. In 1998, the building was torn down to make way for the redevelopment of the area.
new homeThat's right. I myself was just following Mr. Hensley in real time, but Tom Penny *15 was just as much of a hero as Mr. Hensley.
*15 A legendary skater who has won many fans here in Japan for his performance in the 00's, when the skating skill era began. Supported by the British skate team "FLiP" and the sneaker boutique brand "SUPRA," he is still active as a skater today. He has also started an apparel brand, TSA Clothing, with his allies Chad Muska and Jeff Lowry, and countless skaters have been influenced by his iconic outfits, such as layered T-shirts, deep beanies, and wide silhouette loose denim pants.
plainHou. Is there any reason why you fell in love with him?
new homeThe reason why I was attracted to Tom Penny was not only his skating skills like Mr. Hensley, but also his overwhelming individuality, especially in his fashion. I felt that he was not eccentric in terms of individuality, but had a will to maintain his own style.
plainI see. That is an interesting interpretation (laughs).
new homeSpeaking of Tom Penny, he dresses like him sitting over there.
plainDon't tell me Tom Penny is in this venue (laughs)?
new home(Laughter).
(Attention is drawn to a model dressed in Tom Penny's coordination of the time in the exhibition hall.)
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Well, it was this feeling, wasn't it?
plainIt looks like they're still there at all.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)And you seem to be popular.
new homeThe key to Tom Penny's style is the size of the overall silhouette, his trademark beanie, and many other things, but in my opinion, it is his thorough street manner of always matching the color of his T-shirt and sneakers.
plainAh, indeed. I'm starting to feel that way about the times we were watching in real time, too, and looking at photos from the past, I see a lot of color matching.
new homeThat's right. So, although I referred to him earlier as someone who is not very interested in clothes, I can tell from this discussion that he actually had his own particular style and policy.
plainYes, yes, that's what I mean. It seems like you are not particular about it, but you are actually particular about it, which is very appealing from a stylist's point of view.
new homeYes, it's great (laughs). I want to make sure that I pass this on to the young kids today. I want to make sure that the kids who are embodying the style of the 90s now know that Tom Penny was at the forefront of that style (laughs). But it's also interesting that they ended up with a style like Tom Penny's without knowing Tom Penny.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Even so, I liked the fact that sneakers and other items were supported by cutting-edge brands such as *16 and the feeling of being recognized by those who are recognized was also good.
*16 A sneaker brand started in 2006 in Costa Mesa, California, led by Eric Ellington, Jim Greco, and Tom Penny. Team riders include skaters such as Chad Masuka and Terry Kennedy, and recently, the brand has been known to be used by famous celebrities such as Will Smith.
plainTom Penny has a unique aura that keeps people away from him, and he has the image of a loner who doesn't know who he is hanging out with, or a skater who appears and disappears from an unknown habitat, and he has been admired.
new homeHe is no longer a freak.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I like the attitude of American skate brands that they will tolerate such eccentric skaters as long as they are cool. I don't think there are many brands in Japan that have that level of understanding.
There is a lot of information out there now, and there are a lot of skaters to refer to, right? If that's the case, I want people to try out different styles. (Nii)
plainIn the 90s, there were such heroes and an increase in the number of skaters with styles that were clearly different from those of the 80s, and as we headed into the 2000s, the characteristics of skaters became a little more segmented. Of course, at this time, there were still the Hensley school and the Tom Penny school, and at the same time, there were skaters who could not be said to be either of them. Then, Chad Maska *17, a skater who dominated this era, came to the fore.
*17 A professional skater active since the mid-90s. He is known as a pioneer who brought hip-hop style into the skate scene for the first time as a fashion item, and his B-Boy style clothes, tank top, and boom box in one hand became his trademark. As a skater, he has worked for TOY MACHINE, Shorty's, and ELEMENT, and is currently a signature rider for SUPRA.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Oh, yes, Chad Masuka.
plainHe says he's always on the skate deck in a tank top and moving with a boom box in his hand.
new homeHe is no longer a character.
plainThen there is the style of denim pants that are pulled up on one side. This style is rarely seen nowadays.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)The skeezhous are also very bulky.
plainHe was also a famous skater as a fashion icon. And in his skating style, he did hammer tricks *18 one after another. He wore hip-hop style clothes, but at the same time, there were many rock style skaters in those days.
It was like wearing skinny jeans that were extremely thin. At that time, I don't think stretchy materials were available, so it was absolutely difficult to skate in them, but everyone who wore them wore them not for skating ease, but as a matter of principle.
*18 Hammer in the skateboarding industry refers to high-risk, challenging moves and flashy, powerful tricks.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)In the 00's, skaters with different styles were born, but what is interesting about American skaters is their common sense of accepting differences as long as the skating style is cool.
I can mix rock and hip-hop styles. A rock skater like Jamie Thomas (*19), with whom Taro had several sessions, hooked up with a hip-hop skater like Chad Masuka.
*19 A skater who had his heyday in the 90s, known as the pioneer who made handrail tricks popular all over the world. He is also the founder of skate brands such as ZERO and FALLEN, which are still popular among skaters today. His part in the classic video "Dying to Live" is a must-see.
plainYes, I agree. Chad Maska, as I mentioned earlier, is dressed in an outfit that at first glance might make him look foolish, but it's also his character that makes it possible for him to be who he is! He's a character.
new homeIn a word, "character" is based on the premise that as long as you skate, you are cool. That is the case among skaters.
plainOn the other hand, I would like to mention the style of skaters commonly referred to as "hesh*20" skaters, who have been around since the 1990s to be exact, and are mostly San Francisco skaters. They would wear work pants from Dickies with a T-shirt from their favorite skate company, and Vans with bare feet.
Or a work shirt and a trucker cap with the brim unbent. A typical example of this style was Julian Stranger *21, a skater. Their style was also very popular.
On the other hand, in Los Angeles, there were skate teams called "GIRL SKATEBOARDS" and "CHOCOLATE," which I mentioned earlier, and they were dressed rather neatly. They wore white T-shirts and light-colored pants with stylish skates. They had a clean image.
The comparison was made between Hesch, who has a Northern California worker's appearance, and fresh, clean skaters from California, such as those in Los Angeles. However, although they were compared, they were not enemies, and ANTI HERO*22 and GIRL SKATEBOARDS even toured Australia together.
We both recognized each other's skating style, and we also felt a sense of kinship because we are both skaters owned companies. I think skaters are the ones who feel such sympathy for each other.
*20 Fashion-wise, it refers to skaters who, despite their seemingly laborer-like appearance and small, dirty appearance, prefer a rough, masculine skating style. It is often used to refer to white skaters who were mainly found in San Francisco and other cities, and who preferred concrete parks. Julian Stranger, for example, is a prime example.
*21 A famous skater of the past, known as the boss of 〈ANTI HERO〉. His hardcore and masculine riding has established him as a mentor for many skaters. He is also the man who popularized the style known as "heesh.
*22 This deck brand was founded in 1996 by Julian Stranger, a charismatic skater who was also famous as a downhill master in San Francisco. The brand's iconic eagle logo is based on an eagle flying over the San Francisco sky. The team riders include John Cardiel, Tony Trufillo, and other skaters with a genuine hardcore dude mindset.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Skaters Own Company is great, isn't it? We are skaters, and we are running the company on our own. It's like we are warriors.
plainI wonder if Nii and the others have been going to "ANTI HERO" or other styles in this area.
new homeI like the hefty skaters of "ANTI HERO" and the like. In terms of skating style, "GIRL SKATEBOARDS" and the like are a bit too out of this world in their skill, like a circus (laughs).
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Nii, do you have any advice for people who are just starting to skate or are interested in skater fashion? One is to pursue a single style like Hensley, and the other is to incorporate the various styles and good points of skaters who have emerged so far.
new homeIn our time, information and options were limited, so we could only try a few fashion patterns at first, but now there is an overflow of information and many skaters to refer to, right? If that is the case, I would like skaters to experiment with various styles. If you find a skater with a style that suits you, you can explore his/her style further.
plainWhen we look back and examine the past while talking about various things like this, we can come up with the answer that maybe there is no such thing as skater fashion. A long time ago, magazines often used to talk about "skater style," but maybe it is no longer the case.
new homeYeah, it doesn't matter now.
plainSo many kids nowadays are skating in classy shirts nowadays, or skating with their T-shirts in, and as a result, it doesn't matter.
new homeIn our time, we didn't have the idea of skating with a T-shirt inside. As long as you are on a skateboard, anything is possible. That is the most skater-like way.
When putting on clothes, I always keep in mind to make people's movements look beautiful with their clothes. (Hasegawa)
plainYes, that's right. Well, that's about it for the first half of my look back on the transition with skating and fashion as the theme. Thank you, Nii. And now, for the second half, we will continue with the same theme, but from a slightly different perspective. First, I would like to call two guests for the second half. First, I would like to start with Toru Nishiyama-kun.
Toru Nishiyama (hereafter, Nishiyama)Nice to meet you. My name is Toru Nishiyama.
plainAs some of you may know, Toru is the director of the WTAPS brand and also works for the DESCENDANT brand. Toru and I are classmates, and we started skateboarding together when we were students. Next is Akio Hasegawa, a stylist.
Akio Hasegawa ("Hasegawa")My name is Akio Hasegawa. I look forward to working with you.
plainDid you already quit "POPEYE", Mr. Hasegawa?
HasegawaYes, it is.
plainYou've been doing this for what, five and a half years?
HasegawaIt's been about six and a half years.
plainI see. Let's see, Hasegawa-kun was involved with "POPEYE" magazine when it was relaunched about six and a half years ago, and he was a gutsy fashion editor? Is that correct?
HasegawaFashion director, I guess.
plainIn other words, you were in charge of directing fashion pages and Series pages in "POPEYE". One of the things that caught my attention was that you dressed young skaters in clothes and shot fashion stories of model cuts, and I saw that you also used skaters as models in the catalog of Toru's brand "WTAPS".
HasegawaThat's right. Recently, I created a fashion visual for "WTAPS" for the cover and front cover of a Hong Kong magazine called "MILK MAGAZINE.
west side of a mountainThis is a commemorative feature for the opening of the first WTAPS store in Hong Kong in September of this year.
HasegawaIn fact, you have the girls who were models at that time here today. May I ask them to come closer to my seat?
plainI see. Since we are here, let's talk a little about it.
HasegawaThen everyone to the front. In case you are wondering, they are all active skaters. Let's introduce ourselves lightly.
type of dance where the ground is stamped (Heian period)Hi, good evening everyone. My name is Daisaku. I am a freshman in high school.
elm bark clothes traditionally worn by the AinuMy name is Soushi, I am 20 years old. I look forward to working with you.
Shouhei era (of the Northern Court) (1332.4.28-1333.5.?)My name is Shohei, I am 23 years old. I am 23 years old.
plainShohei, you are somewhat 90's style.
Shouhei era (of the Northern Court) (1332.4.28-1333.5.?)Yes, I like the old skater style a lot, especially the New York skaters.
plainWow...you mean in New York in the 90's, when Supreme was just starting up?
Shouhei era (of the Northern Court) (1332.4.28-1333.5.?)Yes, it is!
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Quim or Mike Cardona *23?
*23 Quim Cardona, a New Jersey native and legendary skater of the East Coast skate scene, and his brother, the late Mike Cardona. Along with Harold Hunter and others, these brother skaters continued to embody hip-hop and skating in New York City. The younger brother, Quim, is currently active in the skate scene through skate brands and companies such as Sushi Wheels and Organika.
Shouhei era (of the Northern Court) (1332.4.28-1333.5.?)I like Mike Cardona.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I like it. It's somewhat quim-like in style, though.
plainThank you very much. I'll ask them a few questions again at the right time, but to backtrack a bit, all the photos used in this "MILK MAGAZINE" look like cutouts, what are they really?
HasegawaClippings.
plainDo the model kids ride skateboards as well?
HasegawaOf course I am on it. We shot it in Urayasu, but as it turns out, it didn't make much sense because the background was cropped out (laughs).
plainWas that intended as a cutout from the beginning?
HasegawaFrom the very beginning. When I put on clothes, I always keep in mind that I want to make people's movements look beautiful along with their clothes. That is what I wanted to visualize.
plainHou. Not much skateboarding in the picture, right?
HasegawaThat's right. I have always wanted to take pictures of people in motion rather than people standing still or skateboarding. I wanted to capture people in motion, rather than people standing still or skateboarding.
When it came to photographing the city and its people, skateboarding was the closest thing I could find. (Hasegawa)
plainFor example, if the goal is to move things, there are many ways to do that besides skateboarding, such as playing basketball. Is there a reason why you chose skateboarding?
HasegawaOf course, there were times when I used themes other than skateboarding, but when it came to photographing the city and its people, for example, skateboarding was the closest thing I could come up with.
plainOoh. Indeed.
HasegawaAfter all, when you look at Meiji Dori, you don't see anyone walking around with a basketball poking around.
plainThat's what I've been told. Skateboarding could be done in the city, and since you can choose the background, there are possibilities to take pictures in various places.
HasegawaI wanted to capture the ordinary, everyday life of people on the street. If so, I thought a girl on a skateboard would be a good choice. That's what I was thinking when I was looking for a model.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I found this very refreshing. I felt that the photos were taken without being bound by the rules of skate photography, and I thought that was simply great. It's not taken by a skate photographer or a professional photographer, but somehow it works. That's something only skateboarding and fashion can do.
plainA professional skateboard photographer would not take pictures like this. They would look more at the clean form of the skater's cool push, the firm kick of the feet, the firm swing of the hands, and so on.
HasegawaI choose the photos with an eye to making the clothes look good and the models look good. That is why I don't feature skateboarding techniques that much.
plainI can see why you wanted to use skaters as models, but did you have an idea of what you would like to see skaters dressed like?
HasegawaI don't think I am that conscious about it. I just guessed that this girl would look good in this kind of clothes.
plainFor example, I don't feel at all uncomfortable when skaters wear "WTAPS," but I think that sometimes you dress skaters in clothes or brands that skaters would never wear, such as high-brand clothes.
HasegawaThere are many unusual clothes, especially high-brand clothes, and I was thinking about how to make them look attractive and comfortable, and as a result, I may have had skaters wear them. I thought it would be better to dress children who look like they could be found on the street as the subjects of the clothes. I myself prefer it that way. If you have a person who looks like a model wear the clothes, you can't get that person's sense of style.
plainI want to bring out the best of the ordinary, or rather, the true nature of the person.
HasegawaOn the other hand, it would be interesting to hear how they feel about being dressed.
elm bark clothes traditionally worn by the AinuI had done a little modeling work before I was approached by Mr. Hasegawa, but at first I did very few shoots as a skater, and it was when I thought I could show more of myself that Mr. Hasegawa asked me to model for "POPEYE".
From that time on, I started to enjoy more and more shoots that brought out the best in me as a skater. Mr. Hasegawa understands what I like and what I wear.
plainWhen you dress a model, does Hasegawa-kun ever feel that this model has good intuition?
HasegawaWell, some of the models are slightly different in what they do from what I tell them to do, but I think all the girls here have good instincts. Or maybe their tastes match mine.
type of dance where the ground is stamped (Heian period)When I first started working for "POPEYE," Soushi invited me to model with him. At the time of my first shoot, I had another job, but Soushi told me, "Mr. Hasegawa is a great stylist, so you should definitely come.
It was more like play than modeling, and it was a lot of fun. I also discovered that I could look good in clothes like this and style myself like this. I think that was because he understood me on a day-to-day basis and brought out the real Daisaku in me, not the model Daisaku.
plainIt's about projecting realism.
Shouhei era (of the Northern Court) (1332.4.28-1333.5.?)I am not that active as a model, but when I had the opportunity to work with Mr. Hasegawa for the first time during the "WTAPS" photo shoot, I felt that he really values personality and individuality.
I actually skated too, but on the other hand, I also liked fashion. (Nishiyama)
plainMm-hmm. Thank you. Also, apart from them as models, I think Toru is in the position of asking Hasegawa-kun to do a job for him, what do you expect from him?
west side of a mountainI think it has been four or five years since we started working together, and I was first attracted to the fact that he expresses himself through his own filter. This is reflected in his direction and styling, which is composed of a balance between the reality of fashion and the fantastical aspects that are meticulously crafted and easily conveyed.
I felt that this was also my original experience when I first came into contact with fashion culture. So rather than expecting something definite, I am looking forward to the visuals that Hasegawa will create for us, which will expand the range of ways in which we can present and express our individuality.
HasegawaYes, it is.
west side of a mountainHasegawa, you are always aware of how people move when they play sports, aren't you? I myself understand that feeling very well. When shooting visuals for "WTAPS," I have never requested a skateboarder as a model, but the information and impression one gets from a photo of a model skateboarding and a portrait photo of the same model without any movement, such as the characteristics and silhouette of the clothing, are different. It gives a different information and impression, and above all, it gives a sense of realism.
plainThat's right. I somehow thought that since Toru is a skateboarder, he wanted to use skaters for the "WTAPS" photo shoot, but I guess I was wrong.
HasegawaToru didn't give me any specific orders, and he always basically just told me to go ahead and do whatever I wanted. I loved the NBA when Michael Jordan was in his prime, and reading "Number" and other magazines from that time, I always thought that the expressions on the faces of people playing sports and the natural atmosphere of skateboarding and other physical activities were great, and I wanted to express that as a stylist. I wanted to express that as a stylist.
plainAs Toru mentioned earlier, I thought the fashion in Hasegawa's "POPEYE" had a perfect balance of realism and fantasy. I felt that it was more like a snapshot of a snapshot rather than a model shoot.
Of course, there must be some kind of trick to make it look that way, but I felt the mystery was solved when I heard the stories of the models earlier. I think it was a matter of utilizing, drawing out, or borrowing from the models' original qualities and personalities.
HasegawaI also used to make them eat something.
plainEven the way people hold and eat can make a difference. For example, even if you use such skaters as models, Hasegawa, you have made a proper choice among them, haven't you?
HasegawaYes, I am. If possible, we want to use bright girls with smiling faces. I don't use girls with a dark look. Even if they are into skateboarding and street culture, I don't want to bring out the negative elements such as drugs and the atmosphere of the night. I want to show them in the daytime, when the sun is shining.
plainI see. But if you use amateur models, they don't show up for the shoot! What a surprise, right?
HasegawaWe were shooting every weekend, so such accidents were a daily occurrence. But it couldn't be helped. We were in the prime of our lives, and even if we were told to start filming early on Saturday morning, we would still have fun on Friday night. But in a way, it trained me too. No matter what happens, I always finish the shoot.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Oh, that's kind of skate-like (laughs).
plainWhen I did a shoot with Hasegawa for "POPEYE" once before, the project and number of pages were decided, but we didn't really decide in advance what kind of shoot we would do. We would schedule the shoot for a week or so, and then when it was time to get on the location bus, we would decide where we would go today (laughs). (Laughs) Of course, there were times when we had a firm decision, but it was a flexible style.
HasegawaIt's like enjoying a live performance. When we first started filming Soushi, we just invited him and if he liked it, we would film it. First of all, I fed him a pork cutlet sandwich.
plainSoshi, you must have been surprised.
elm bark clothes traditionally worn by the AinuThat's right. I was like, "What is this shooting about?
I don't like the idea that this is how a skater should be. (Ozawa)
kozawa (Clausena lansium)But Taro was like that too, right?
plainWhen we were shooting for specialty magazines, we were like that, cruising around skating spots and taking pictures when we found a good spot. There were days when the skaters weren't in the mood, and there were days when we didn't shoot at all. There were days when we went all the way to Nagoya and didn't take a single picture (laughs).
kozawa (Clausena lansium)We went to Nagoya for two nights and three days, but Taro didn't press the shutter button once, so all the skaters we went around with were like, "What, you didn't take any pictures? (laughs).
plainBut I had never met a stylist who shoots in that style before.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I also wanted to ask you something. Like Taro, you have been skateboarding for a long time, and I think you probably have a favorite skater or skating style, but did you ever think of expressing that image through the WTAPS brand?
west side of a mountainWhen it comes to creating visuals, I have no desire to express my personal side. I want to express my accumulated influences from various cultures in the form of products.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)I see. Thank you very much. By the way, who is the all-time hero of skateboarding for you, Toru?
west side of a mountainI have always loved the San Francisco scene, so Tommy Guerrero is special in terms of fashion and style. On the other hand, Julian Stranger, who Taro mentioned earlier, was also an iconic figure. I guess the original scene of skateboarding for us is that of the 80s.
plainDid you have that in mind when you renewed "POPEYE"?
HasegawaPOPEYE" is a magazine with a history of more than 40 years, but there was nothing we could do about the last 20 years or so. I didn't want to just take over "POPEYE" from that bad period. I felt that most of the fashion magazines nowadays are embarrassing to own, and I wanted to make a fashion magazine that people would feel good about owning.
Then I wondered what "POPEYE" was like in its better days. It was a fashion magazine that not only used large photographs, but also had a more detailed layout. It's not a fashion magazine that emphasizes photography, but rather fashion photography that emphasizes fashion. I guess that's what made it different from other magazines.
plainWhen you put it that way, I feel that way. I think that Hasegawa's "POPEYE" had a composition with a clear vision, rather than just using good photos.
HasegawaWe wanted the magazine to be a magazine of information, not a magazine of clothes you want to buy someday, but a magazine of clothes you want to buy tomorrow. That is why photos and subjects were very important. I wanted people to be able to imagine that there are people like them around them, and to be able to replace the models with themselves. I wanted the magazine to be something that people could feel close to.
plainCome to think of it, if you look at the magazine pages that Hasegawa has worked on so far, there are many rain scenes.
HasegawaFor some reason, it always rains. In the past, we often got caught in the rain and had no choice but to shoot scenes in which we had to use umbrellas.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)He's a rain man (laughs).
plainRain is a no-no in terms of skateboarding, but skating and fashion photography are both affected by the environment of the city.
kozawa (Clausena lansium)Yes, that's right. Personally, I don't think skateboarding is a specialized field, and skaters are human beings after all, eating cutlet sandwiches and liking girls just like everyone else.
I am also in the position of making a specialized magazine, but I don't like the idea that this is the way skaters should be. The same goes for models like them. If a magazine wants to shoot a ride, they can do it, and if they want to shoot a fashion shoot, they can also play a role as a model. That kind of flexibility is one of the best things about skateboarding.
HasegawaI think so.
plainMm-hm. There was still a lot to talk about, but it looks like it's time to go, so I'm going to close HSC vol.5 now. Thank you all very much! The next meeting will be held on Saturday, January 26 next year. The theme will be "Skateboarding and DIY" with a workshop. We will let you know about the guests and the detailed time as soon as possible, so please come and visit us all.
INFORMATION
HOUYHNHNM SKATEBOARD CLUB
Various cultural events have been launched under the name "VACANT CUL-TURE CLUB" in the first floor space of the Harajuku gallery "VACANT," which was renovated this summer. As part of this initiative, we will hold hands-on lecture events on the theme of HOUYHNHNM's and skate culture. The main hosts will be "Sb" editor-in-chief Chiichiro Ozawa and photographer Taro Hirano, who will give a roundtable lecture once a month, with a different theme and guest each time, and with the participation of general participants (auditing students).
Also, workshops where event participants and visitors can actually experience the products will be held on an irregular basis. Stay tuned. Below are the details of the sixth lecture.
HSC VOL.6 "Skateboarding and DIY
Date: Saturday, January 26, 2019 13:00-15:30 Workshop (This workshop is only available on a first-come, first-served basis. The fee is 3,800 yen.) 16:00-18:00 Lecture Event
Place: VACANT 1F (3-20-13 Jingumae, Shibuya-ku, Tokyo) Guest: Mr. Koji Oba (Oba Gumi, WoodenToy)
If you are interested in participating, please apply through the inquiry page below. www.vacant.vc
