They are doing it as a sport, but we are doing it as a walk (Kai).
Kobayashi:（When I went to Greenland with (photographer) Naoki Ishikawa, we talked for a long time in the hotel cafeteria because it was December and the sun had not risen at all. He told me many stories related to mountain climbing. Don't you have any stories about trails like in the U.S.? I asked him if there were any trails like the ones in the U.S., and he told me that there was a trail that went around the top of the fifth station of Mt. Fuji. It's not up and down at all, but the scenery keeps changing because of Mt. Fuji. I finally realized that there is such an interesting feeling of walking on flat terrain in Japan. Everyone has to climb to the top to feel satisfied, don't they? I guess because of the proximity of the mountains, they feel halfway there if they don't climb them.
I wonder if people tend to revere the height of mountains.
Kobayashi:The sense of freedom after suffering is a pleasure we can all share, isn't it? It's a totally different mentality from the feeling of strolling around in casual clothing. That's what I think is different from my story.
By the way, what is your own outdoor situation?
Yazumi:I just like to go to America and find used outdoor wear at thrifts and flea markets, that's all.
Kobayashi & Kai:(Laughter).
Yazumi:I'm in a state where I'm specializing myself in "making clothes," so I don't have anything else to do right now. I just don't have the time (laughs). If I could, I would like to do what the two of you do, but seriously, all I do is work.
Kobayashi:You are turning into Golgo 13 as a pattern maker (laughs). When you have Yazane draw a pattern for you, even if you don't check the intended functions, just having it makes you feel like, "I hope I can go on the trek someday," right? I think that kind of thing is good. Even the shirt with the ventilation open, there must be a sense of being able to use it on the trek, and there must also be a sense of fulfillment somewhere in there, even if you don't go. I think it would be nice to get that kind of uplift. At a glance, it looks like plain basic wear, so I don't feel uncomfortable wearing it in the city. It doesn't even have "BAMBOOSHOOT" embroidered on it, which I think is the point. I think that's the point. It's everyday wear that doesn't fall prey to hegemony.
Kai:（Maybe it's a bad habit (not signing the brand). Maybe I'm thinking somewhere that they won't see the 1001 TP10T I've done.
Kobayashi:I don't think it needs to be communicated. If you buy these (Fatigue) pants, you can keep them for 10 years. They may last longer, and there will be things that will become clear later on. I think it would be interesting if, when you buy something else, you notice again how good it is, or how hard it is to wear. It's not like I'm saying, "Please only wear these clothes for the rest of your life.
These so-called baker pants are made of cotton back satin fabric, just like the U.S. military government-issued ones. The biggest difference from the original is that the zip fly extends beyond the inseam to the hips. This allows the wearer to do his business in the middle of a trek without having to take them off. The drawcord at the waist eliminates the need for a belt. Fatigue Cropped Pants Satin ¥33,000
Each item has the feeling of "coming into its own later on.
Kobayashi:I am always aware of the "after-effects. The same is true for pattern makers, and also for brand makers when they are planning a project. If it doesn't work later, it is meaningless.
Yes, that's right. However, I feel that the times are moving more and more toward the "deuchiuchi" style.
Kobayashi:That's right. People buy things only by looking at pictures, illustrations, and explanations, and there is no longer any need to actually touch things and talk about "this part..." I think.
Kai:Things are already different, aren't they? I wear both "de-ochi" things and post-effects things together, but they are in different places to begin with. I still want things that have a sense of being out of place. I still buy a lot of sneakers.
I see what you mean. However, as information becomes more and more rapid and voluminous, there are fewer opportunities for people to experience how to enjoy and interact with clothing, which is something that comes later.
Kobayashi:Well, people don't have that much money and you don't buy a lot of things. I think everyone will be poorer after this... It would be nice if we could get to the answer, or rather, the theme we like, as quickly as possible. Then we won't have to waste money.
I feel that the quality and design of these products, which can be used for a long time, fulfills one of the responsibilities of the manufacturers.
Kai:If people who like this kind of thing continue to make it, they will create something different from others. I want to be a part of that.
Kobayashi:Well, what I do is no different from touts in a bar area. They call out, "We have a gimmick! As a result, only those who are interested come in (laugh).
Kai:And he wants to look like a prep school. I'm wearing a chambray shirt and military pants (laughs).
The more polarized the environment, the more primary colors are beneficial and the more high-tech is necessary, but that's not the theme of this project, is it?
Kai:Yup. I feel more comfortable with the usual feeling. It's just like field trips when I was a kid. You know, "Let's go with comfortable shoes and school jerseys. Climbing a mountain wearing Arcteryx, I feel great, but I don't feel like I'm using all the functions. I do feel secure, though.
Kobayashi:Everyone is anxious. So, a wide variety of products are available to drown out their anxiety. Everything is designed to eliminate some kind of anxiety. Waterproof, lightweight, functions, and so on. But the fact of the matter is, lightweight is really good (laughs). (laughs) This is the trend of the times, so we can't resist it.
But these cargo shorts seem to go against that, with their heavy, old-fashioned fabric.
Kai:In the store, we deal with lightweight items, but I wanted to think of lightweight as different from sturdy.
Kobayashi:You can do this with lighter fabrics, but there are plenty of them out there already.
Kai:If it were made of nylon, it wouldn't have this atmosphere in the first place.
Six-pocket cargo shorts based on the M-51. They also feature front and back zip fly and a drawcord waist. The look is authentic, but the layout of the pockets has been subtly rearranged for practicality. The shape is thicker and the hem can be narrowed. m-51 field cargo shorts, satin, ¥38,500
Hiking is all about living in touch with nature, breathing good air, and other such aspects, and it is difficult to find a style to go with it.
Kobayashi:I think that's fine, but what I always wish I could convey is the other side of that feeling.
Kobayashi:I used to read "(Baron Mabel's) Backpacking Instructions" by Yoshio Tabuchi (and co-authored by Sheridan Anderson), and Tabuchi writes, "It feels good to smoke a smoke and walk around," and it was the first American standard book that attached the outdoors and marijuana stories together! I thought, "I read that. Before that, there was absolutely no mention of that anywhere I looked. It's just the serious... the hiking from the front door that I talked about at the beginning of the book, and there's no mention of side streets anywhere. People only think of it that way, but I thought I'd rather have a side story.
Kai:The movie "Into the Wild" is one such outdoor movie. The outdoor brand's mountain climbing activities are actually recorded by many Japanese people. There is an outdoor industry centered around these people, but what we are doing is different. What we do is different from that. They are more serious, and they do it as a sport. What we do is just a walk.
Kobayashi:It's amazing, isn't it? I'm an athlete. But that's a competitive story. We are in the mountains or on the trails, looking for a place that is an extension of our daily lives.
Kai:If they say, "This ain't no game," I have to say, "Hi, I'm sorry."
(laughs). But I was impressed by the fact that the theme of the story is trails and the "side street trek" is so well done, even if it is just a coincidence.
Kobayashi:That's right. Usually, everyone boasts about their verticals.
Kai:If possible, you don't want to go to the mountains when the weather is bad, right? I think that's fine.
Kobayashi:No, really. There are just too many stories out there that aren't.
I don't know if this is a silly question, but have you ever been interested in 8,000m peaks or death zones?
Kobayashi:Not at all! I'm not interested in anything where there is no casual atmosphere at all. That kind of thing is an adventure, not an extension of the everyday, so that's another thing.
Kai:I like to watch those movies (laughs).
Kobayashi:It's completely outdoors on the wrong side of the road! That's what we're doing. But we've been doing it for a long time, wanting to give back somehow with this kind of thing. We can't stop until these values become widespread.
